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J. T. Martin Cross Exam.

The counsel for the protestants (J. C. Price, lawyer for the citizens of Skagway ) cross examined a series of the witnesses called by the claimants (Moore and the company). The cross-examination of Bernard Moore's witness, J. T. Martin, was conducted on February 18, 1898. In his line of questioning, it is obvious that the citizens wished to show that Bernard Moore, himself, had done little to develop the land as a trading or manufacturing site. 

FEBRUARY 18, 1898



Hearing was resumed at 1:30 p.m. [February 18, 1898]. J.T. Martin, one of the witnesses of the applicant, was sworn and cross-examined as follows:

Q. When to your knowledge did Mr. Moore take up this land as a trading and manufacturing site?

A. I first knew of his being on the land the latter part of '87. My understanding was that he was going to reside there and open a trading post.

Q. Where did you get that information?

A. From Mr. Moore.

Q. Did you hear Mr. Moore's testimony to the effect that he originally took it up for agricultural purposes?

A. I heard him say that he took it up for agricultural purposes, yes.

Q. You knew that at that time in 1887 that he had taken it up for trade and manufacturing purposes?

A. No.

Q. When did you first know of his taking it up for a trading and manufacturing site?

A. Spring of '98, I knew that he had taken it for a trading post for some time but knew nothing in regard to it to being used for manufacturing site.

Q. Do you know of his having done any trading or manufacturing there prior to the year 1896?

A. In regard to the manufacturing no, and also as to the trading I couldn’t say of my own knowledge. I never did any trading with him or saw him trading.

Q. Do you know of his having a general stock of supplies exhibited for the general purposes of trade up to the year l896?

A. No sir, I do not.

Q. How often have you been on upon the land embraced within his claim up to and including the year 1896?

A. I should say any how 10 or 12 times.

Q. How much of the time up to and including the year 1896 has Mr. Moore


been upon the land embraced within the claim?

A. I never landed there but very few times but what I found him or some of his representatives there.

Q. Who were his representatives?

A. At times I found his father there, at other times I found men there that I didn't ask their names.

Q. Do you know whether those men were his representatives or not?

A. They were there ready to transact his business for him in case we had anything to leave for him.

Q. When you came to his land what was your purpose or object?

A. In the course of business of steam-boating up and down the channel, we would go in there for anchorage, to leave freight or letters or anything of that kind.

Q. You was [sic] in the steamboat business during the time mentioned?

A. Yes, have the major part of the time I have been in Alaska.

Q. How extensive was the freight and supplies you left there up to and including the year,1898?

A. I couldn't say in regard to that at this time; haven't kept any books; at no time any very great amount.

Q. Were there ever any more than supplies and tools necessary for the use of himself and family?

A. I couldn't say whether there was or not in regard to that.

Q. Up to the year 1896 was his claim ever regarded as a trading post generally by the public?

A. I can’t say that it was a great deal, as there was very little travel there.

Q. Was it over regarded as a trading post at all?

A. I have heard people say they could get supplies there.

Q. Was [sic] you ever up to his place of business?

A. I have been to his house. The log cabin in which he lived.


Q. When was that, the last time, up to the year 1896?

A. I couldn't give no date at all.

Q. Did you see any other building besides the log cabin on the land?

A. I can't say that I did at that time, up to '96.

Q. Did you see any stock or provisions being exhibited for sale in the log cabin in which Mr. Moore lived?

A. There might have been provisions that I didn't notice. I paid no attention wasn't looking for anything of that kind.

Q. Was that log cabin a store or a residence?

A. I should consider it a residence.

Q. What other improvements did you see upon Mr. Moore's land?

A. In '96 I see considerable timber out there, a float built, abutments for a wharf, cribbing. I think at the time he showed me where he had some ground cleared.

Q. Nothing more than a few piles driven for the wharf?

A. He had some cribs built there and a few piles driven.

Q. What do you know of Mr. Moore's engaging in trading in 1896?

A. Of my own knowledge, I never bought anything there of him. I never saw any one else buy anything.

Q. Did you see any store on the land in controversy in the year l896?

A. I didn't see any goods exposed for sale, didn't happen to pay any attention to such things, wasn't look[ing]for them. I can't say that I saw any store.

Q. When, of your own personal knowledge, did you see Mr. Moore doing any trading or manufacturing on the land in controversy?

A. About the 18th or 19th of July, 1897.

Q. What was he conducting then?

A. Selling some hay.

Q. When did you first notice any store of Mr. Moore's on the land?

A. Can't say that I ever seen any store on the land, that is of my own knowledge that it was a store.


Q. Do you know of any store of your own knowledge being conducted upon the land by Mr. Moore?

A. I never bought anything of Mr. Moore in my life, consequently, I can't say of my own knowledge that he is selling any goods.

Q. Do you know of any store on the land over which Moore is exer­cising acts of ownership or control?

A. During the first week of July I took a good deal of supplies to Mr. Moore. I asked him what he was doing with them, and he told me he was running a store.

Q. Do you know of your own knowledge who built that saw mill upon the land?

A. While it was in the bourse of instruction, I see Mr. Moore working on it.

Q. Do you know of Moore paying for the material and labor?

A. I do not. He told me at the time he was working on it that it was his mill.

Q. Do you know who is conducting the mill at the present time?

A. I do not sir.

Q. Do you know who is managing it?

A. No sir.

Q. Have you had any business transactions with the mill?

A. Have not.

Q. Do you know at this time how much of the land in controversy is now actually occupied by Moore or people representing him?

A. Approximately, I think, somewhere close to 20 acres.

Q. What use is the rest being put to?

A. The principal part of it is in the hands of parties who have built on it.

Q. What improvements have they made on the land they are occupying?

A. Business houses and residences.

Q. About what is the value of such improvements?


A. I would think in the neighborhood of approximately $75,000.00.

Q. What is the source of your information that the value of the trade and business conducted upon said land by Bernard Moore is now the sum of $8,000 per month?

A. My own observations.

Q. What does this trade and business consist of that you have observed?

A. Teaming and the product of the saw mill principally.

Q. What is the saw mill doing at the present time, what business?

A. At the present time I could not say that the saw mill is doing anything right now.

Q. Have you known at any time?

A. I couldn’t say positively. I have been told that it was turning out 15,000 feet daily of lumber. I got the information from a man who is running an engine in the mill.

Q. When was the saw mill put up?

A. Commenced cutting the latter part of July, l897.

Q. Do you know of your own knowledge who paid for those improvements placed upon this land?

A. Nothing, only what I have been told, sir.

Q. You have known Mr. Moore for the last ten years or so?

A. Yes.

Q. Has he been generally known as a man or wealth during that time?

Counsel for the claimant asks the land officers to summarily exclude the question as irrelevant.

Counsel for protestant offers to deduce by this line of cross examination that Mr. Moore has never been considered a man of any wealth; that he has worked for his living as a laborer for others up to and including the year 1896.

The decision of the board is that the objection is sustained as the question is immaterial and irrelevant at this time. Counsel for protestants except to the ruling.


Q. What do you know, of your own knowledge, as to the amount and extent of the business Mr. Moore is engaged in in teaming?

A. I learned from a man who was driving a team for him that he had six teams working at that time.

[Signed] J. T. Martin

I hereby certify that the foregoing testimony was by me read and corrected in the presence of the witness, and that it was then subscribed to by him at my offioe in Sitka, Alaska, this 18th day of February, 1898.

[Signed] John W. Dudley, Register

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